The Acknowledgement of Extremes

Image from www.hyperpreteristarchive.com (Todd Dennis)
THE PURPOSE of this article is to acknowledge and to discuss the fact that extremes do exist within the framework of biblical preterism. [1] In recent years, a zealous host of “former” preterists has arisen, shielded within the ranks of Futurist evangelical “orthodoxy” and determined to destroy that for which they once rejoiced and gladly endured the reproach and disdain of their contemporaries–the same ones who now congratulate their departure from such a “damnable heresy.”
Articles have been published, books written, and websites erected whose only purpose is the tearing down and criticism of others with whom they now disagree. While the motives of each one are known only to God, their comments and actions certainly speak for themselves far beyond anything this writer could either quote or document. Their “root of bitterness” is evident to anyone who cares to investigate the matter more closely (Heb. 12:15). For some of these “former” preterists, it was the existence of certain extreme positions that caused them to fall away from the truth, instead of finding the place of balance in their own faith and lives. For others, the seeming coldness of preterist intellectualism rather than increased spirituality caused them to run for the shelter of a more “idealistic” (subjective) theology. The problematic existence of “anti-ism” and “liberalism” as extremes within the preterist movement have lead some to conclude that Completed Redemption must be rejected and therefore that Futurist theology must necessarily now be true.
DEFINITION OF TERMS
Most readers are not familiar with the proper definition of either “anti-ism” or “liberalism” as it exists within the context of preterist theology. “Anti-ism” is a form of legalism that binds where God has not bound–elevates matters of opinion into matters of faith. “Liberalism” comes in under the guise of “grace” or “liberty” and looses where God has bound–transforms matters of faith into matters of opinion. Preterist examples of “anti-ism” are those who seek to bind their opinions on others regarding such issues as, the nature of the church since 70 C.E., the cessation of certain features of ministry, including baptism and the observance of the Lord’s Supper are no longer valid. Those who would support the continuation of Evangelists, Pastors and Teachers within the context of the local body of believers (church), including the necessity of baptism and regular observance of the Lord’s Supper are condemned by these who espouse “anti-ism.” Preterist examples of “liberalism” are manifested by those who have embraced various forms of “Comprehensive Grace” (Universalism), so-called “Beyond Creation Science,” and certain aspects of the “Emergent Church” theology fiasco. Those who reject such unbiblical concepts are considered “old-timers” and “unenlightened.” The use of such terms, while not absolute, certainly illustrates the danger and presence of a tendency on the part of some toward imbalance.
Since extremes do exist within biblical preterism, does this imply that one must “throw out the theological baby with the extremist bathwater?” Not at all. This behavior is identical to that which existed within the confines of the first-century community of faith by the Judaizers who sought to bind observance of the Mosaic Law on the Gentiles requiring them to first be circumcised when obeying the gospel (Acts. 15:1-29; Gal. 2:1-21). These brethren were practicing “anti-ism” and binding where God had not bound and therefore were corrected of their error. Likewise, a faction within the Gentiles existed that misunderstood the “liberty” of the gospel as an excuse to continue in their sinful conduct (Rom. 6:1, 2 et al). The existence of the two extremes did not and does not negate the balance of the truth that lies between the two.
Preterism has become a virtual “magnet” for everyone with a “hobby-horse” to ride. Negative encounters with various forms of Futurist evangelical Christianity has sent thousands of people on a perpetual journey with no place upon which to land–so Preterism becomes an attraction for them. The emotional need for such ones to find theological validation in some “distinctive” viewpoint that sets them apart from their former experiences only serves to perpetuate the problem. This new crop of “unlearned and unstable” preterist zealots (II Pet. 3:16) are often ” tossed and carried about by all kinds of teachings that change like the wind” (Eph. 4:14), “always studying but are never able to recognize the truth” (II Tim. 3:7). Those who are mature in the faith ought to remain ever vigilant in affirming those principles associated with “sound doctrine” rather than to allow those carried away into the extremes to perish (Titus 1:9; 2:1).
BLOG-OLATRY
Each person ultimately renders “an account of himself to God” for that which he believes and practices (Rom. 14:12). There is no escaping the consequences of that which one does in this realm of existence (II Cor. 5:10; Heb. 9:27). Although the eschatological Judgment Day has long ago past, individual responsibility before God remains as part of the everlasting New Covenant. The fact that pre-70 C.E. believers already experiencing the fullness and power of the “age to come” understood their accountability provides the foundational basis upon which those living 2,000 later continues to stand (Heb. 6:5). Those who mistakenly believe that fulfillment implies only an “end” and nothing beyond that time are lacking the proper balance and biblical perspective necessary in order to experience the abundant life God now has to offer.
There is a great debt owed even to the strongest detractors of Completed Redemption. The ease with which many are prone to embrace whatever doctrinal notion is presented or dangled in front of them is a dangerous problem with respect to the future of past fulfillment. The extremes threaten to overshadow the glorious truth that lies between. Not every website or blog that sells or brands itself as a “Preterist” haven of rest, can be trusted as a reliable source of balanced truth. Not every “man of God” is the genuine article and therefore each person who listens to or reads his teachings must first “prove all things, hold fast that which is good” (I Thess. 5:21). This generation of believers must take care not to commit “blog-olatry” by accepting anything and everything they see on the Internet. The old addage, “all that glitters is not gold” is true.
On the other hand, not everything posted by “former” preterists is an accurate portrayal of the facts either. Sometimes even the most honest refutation of a particular position is clouded beneath the haze of subjective human emotions and experiential disappointments. To leave behind a whole community of friends and those who were once considered “brethren” being disillusioned and disappointed often leads that one into other forms of depression, imbalance or inconsistency. There is no future in Futurism in it’s varied forms and many manifestations–Premillennial, Post-millenial, Amillennial or even the more recent Idealist paradigms.
Todd Dennis, makes the following observation about Hyper-Preterism (a recent tag line attributed to the teaching of Completed Redemption):
The HyP teaching that the New Covenant wasn’t in its full establishment until long after the cross event shows how Hyper Preterism is fundamentally different from Christianity as it has always been known. This “AD70 storyline” is foreign to the Bible, and to Christianity as a whole throughout all of its centuries and denominations. Only the Universalists of the last 200 years have embraced this type of AD70-centrism. [2]
Futurists are far more guilty of denying the efficacy of the Cross of Christ and the establishment of the New Covenant than anything ever presented within the ranks of the preterist community. Calling attention to the extreme position of Universalism misses the point completely. What about the Futurist who denies the Cross with the implication that salvation remains incomplete and unfulfilled? Premillennial author Rene Pache, in his classic presentation on The Return of Jesus Christ states:
While his [Christ] absence continues, we are not yet in possession of complete salvation. Our sorrows continue, and alas! too often our failures also, while the enemy wages a merciless war against us. But let us take courage, for soon we shall burst into songs of happiness and adoration, when Jesus, going forth again from the heavenly sanctuary, shall come to save us totally and definitively. [3]
Is this the victorious “message of the Cross” proclaimed by apostles living under the expectation of the nearness of the Parousia of Christ of which Todd Dennis and others wish to support? 2,000 years (and counting) of failed promises and unrealized expectations are the heritage which every Futurist must embrace because no other “logical” conclusion than was expressed by Pasche exists within that faulty framework. How does this view of incomplete salvation magnify the Cross of Christ and produce a sense of joy within the hearts and minds of the waiting multitudes?
The post-Cross and pre-70 C.E. ministry of Jesus Christ was moving toward a stated “end” or “goal”–that of removing the remaining elements of an Old Covenantal system that could not provide forgiveness and salvation for people and into the realm of a New Covenant system where both forgiveness and salvation are a present reality. Certainly the Cross is the central message of God’s eternal purpose, but just as certainly also was the hope of the Parousia as the consummating act of God in the completion of the process that was set in motion. Jesus Christ “finished” His work as “the Lamb of God that takes away the sin of the world” (John 1:29), and “began” His work as High Priest and as King of kings and Lord of lords following His resurrection and ascention–entering into the heavenly sancuary to administer the benefits of His sacrificial death on the Cross. The rest of the New Testament is the “storyline” of consummation–how that precious message was taken to “every nation under heaven” (Acts. 1:8; Rom. 16:26; Col. 1: 23) in fulfillment of the Great Comission (Mark 16:15, 16; Matt. 28:18-20)–“unto the end (consummation) of the age” (Matt. 28:20)
CONCLUSION
There is every reason to acknowledge the existence of extremes with the framework of preterism, without the necessity of denying the truth of the total message of Completed Redemption within the confines of theological balance. Beyond the theology surrounding preterist teaching is the need now, more than ever before, for believers to actively demonstrate the power of the message as evidenced in their daily walk with the Lord. Completed Redemption demands that believers, as “partakers of the divine nature” (II Pet. 1:4) produce fruit that is consistent with the reality of that which we now affirm. The devotional nature of what Completed Redemption means to each of us and how it affects are daily walk of victory in this world is a key element that cannot be ignored. The “fruit of righteousness” evidenced in the lives of believers can and must serve as a powerful demonstration of the truth of this message.
Completed Redemption means that believers are better husbands and wives, better mothers and fathers, better children, better employers and employees, and better citizens. Intellectual arguments and logical presentations are a poor substitute for actual relationship with God that is lived out in our daily interactions with people of the world and at home. Discussions about “time statements” and speculations about other points of doctrine provides little comfort for the millions whose marriages are being consumed, whose lives are being destroyed by sexual immorality, drug and alcohol abuse, homelessness and poverty. The true message of Jesus Christ alone in the context of all He has accomplished has the power to change lives and to “bind up the brokenhearted”–as was the original intention.
A final word for those whose only purpose in life has become the destruction of so-called Hyper-Preterism: Find the peace of God and devote your efforts to something positive, something that builds the Kingdom of God instead of seeking to destroy and undermine the faith of others who have gone on their way rejoicing in the reality of Completed Redemption. A sad as it may seem, there will aways be “former” preterists who somehow lost their sense of joy and who tumbled back into the darkness of the “almost” but “not quite” of Futurist eschatology.
As long as the centrality of the Cross is championed by preterists, the eschatology will remain in balance. It is just as wrong to “see” 70 C.E. in every verse of the Bible as it is in ignoring the historical significance of the events that transpired historically. The Cross was both a historical and a redemptive event–the two things are not mutually exclusive. It was God who chose to interject and the manifest Himself in human affairs and history. The Bible cannot be seen as “anti-historical” anymore than it can be seen as “anti-spiritual.” To two concepts operate in complete harmony and balance. May God give us the wisdom to preach the full and complete gospel of Christ each and every day!
FOOTNOTES
[1] Biblical Preterism is the teaching that the second or final coming of Jesus Christ, the Resurrection of the dead, and the Judgment occurred with the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 C.E. More accurate terms such as “Accomplished Salvation” or “Completed Redemption” are preferred by KINGDOM VICTORY since the emphasis is correctly placed on the finished work of the Cross of Christ and those predicted events that would accompany the consummation or fulfillment of that work through the establishment of the New Covenant (Heb. 13:20).
[2] Todd Dennis, AD70 Storyline Fundamentally Different from Historic Christianity (Hyper-Preterist Archive) 01/09/09.
[3] Rene Pasche, The Return of Jesus Christ (Condensed Edition) (Chicago: Moody Bible Institute: 1975). 26.

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Yeah ok Larry — keep sweeping, the rug awaits. Not only are you hypocritical for naming Todd in your little puff piece & NOT naming these supposed “extreme” HYPER-preterists you’re talking about. Why not? Don’t want to upset your buddies? Don’t worry, Sam is building a new movement where the Virgils of the world left off. Sam is making “new kind of delusion”. Even though it is just a hold-out island, you might be safe there.
And you might have a bit of integrity to tell your readers that you lifted the article’s picture from Todd…the very guy you are naming here.
And on the contrary, I don’t want the hyperpreterist movement to be destroyed. I want it to come out of the shadows. I want it to push itself to its logical conclusions. I want it to accept what it really is. The ones you call “extreme” are the REAL movers of the movement. They are REAL ones in charge. Look what they even said about your hero Sam:
Are you going to be “left behind” too Larry? So much for your “seasoned” teaching abilities — the hyperpreterist train is going to leave without out. You’d better ditch these wanna-be pseudo-conservatives & get in line for a gig with the so-called “extremes” or you’ll end up in the dust bin as well.
Sweep, sweep away Larry –
Larry,
You’re misrepresenting Pasche’s position. The New Testament represents the believers salvation as incomplete until the redemption of his body. Salvation applies to both components of man (soul and body), and not just the soul. Holding this position is quite different from saying that nobody was enjoying the benefits of the New Covenant until 40 years after Christ’s death. Pasche never said that, did he??
We have to be careful, because the line of argument that “all was finished” (that is every single aspect of our redemption) in A.D. 30 could be used to deny a future physical resurrection and second coming of Christ.
I believe that Christ’s death on the cross fully met the spiritual requirements for Israel’s redemption and restoration, and that because of Israel’s rejection believers now (both Jews and Gentiles) may participate in the spiritual benefits of the New Covenant. Participation in these benefits began on Pentecost, and not 40 years later.
Brian
Brian
There is an abundance of evidence of the co-existence of the two covenantal systems during the transition period between the Cross and 70 C.E.
2 Cor 3:11
For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious. NKJV
The Old Covenant was (present-tense) “passing away” and the glory of the New Covenant would “remain.” There was a transition period in which the one was passing away while the other was being established.
2 Cor 3:11
For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.
NKJV
2 Cor 3:11
For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.
NKJV
Heb 8:13
In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete. Now what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away. NKJV
The Old Covenant “is becoming” (present-tense) obsolete and growing old and is “ready” (about to) vanish away.
The fact of the 40 year transition period in which the Old Covenant system was being dismantled does not reflect negatively on the power of the Cross through which covenantal change was “being” accomplished.
Larry,
Amen. The cross of Jesus compared to the two theives meant what? What was so special about the cross of Jesus? Well, first, he was the Incarnate One, the Son of God. If this first aspect of fulfilled prophecy is undermined, or not stressed, or somehow not as important as the cross, then the cross, in and of itself, by itself, is meaningless. Just another Jew nailed by the Romans for insurrection. No, this time it was different because he was no ordinary Jew.
What about the ministry of Christ? That, too, was a fulfillment of prophecy, was it not? Isn’t the ministry of Christ presented in the Gospels as a fulfillment of Isaiah and other Prophets? Thus, his Incarnation AND his ministry were important features…without them, this Jesus was just another rogue Jew preaching to whoever would hear him.
Now, we come to the Trial, that too a fulfillment of Scriptures as presented in the Gospels. Important indeed. NECESSARY, in fact, if this Yeshua bar Yoseph was who he said he was. Then we have the cross. We can now appreciate its uniqueness…but, take away the aforementioned things, Incarnation, birth, ministry, trial, and the cross is meaningless.
But, the Prophets do not stop there. No. There is the Resurrection that was predicted “according to the Scriptures” too. What’s the cross apart from the resurrection?
The Prophets are not finished….The Ascension and Exaltation. Surely these things MUST occur in order for our salvation to be what it is. If Jesus died on the cross and stayed in the tomb to rot, what salvation would we claim? Nothing. And his reign at the right hand of the Father….very necessary, for this vindicated his suffering. Now, the final piece of the Prophets: His Parousia – when “completes” and “perfects” all that he had subsequently accomplished. The icing on the cake, the capstone on the building, the head on the body. Without the Parousia, what meaning has the cross? None. This is true even of futurist theology. ALL these things must be accomplished and ALL these things are IMPORTANT. Without one of them, then Jesus is not Messiah and Son of God. By proclaiming ALL of them fulfilled, Jesus is King, Prophet, Preist and Son, God all in all. Praise be to His Holy Name.
Sam
It is really tough to interact on these issues by blog or post because there is just so much to talk about.
First of all, I hope that the “acknowledgment of extremes” is acceptance of the concept that there is such a thing as “hyper” preterism. Full preterists insist that the term is only a pejorative, but that is not so. It is an actual, functioning term used to describe doctrines which go too far and are harmful. If you believe that these extremes exist, then please come up with your own clear definition of “hyper preterism” to help prevent newcomers from being trapped. Doing so will certainly open more doors for preterist evangelism, as well. Also, if that term is used legitimately within the full preterist circles, then the pejorative value of its use will dissipate.
Now, with all that said… I would like to point out that the thrust of my article was never addressed here – nor has it yet been discussed in any post or comment that I have seen.
In short, the point is this: The Bible says, in contradistinction to full preterism, that access had already been given to the Most Holy Place prior to AD70 and that the problem of separation between man and God was revealed to have been settled at the cross (Jesus said “it is finished” and the veil of separation tore).
Many verses can be offered in support of this position. Perhaps this is the clearest:
Hebrews 10:19-22 “Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of Jesus, By a new and living way, which he hath consecrated for us, through the veil, that is to say, his flesh; And having an high priest over the house of God; Let us draw near..”
All the squabbling about this, that, and the other aspect of theology has nothing to do with this simple point. Obviously, our salvation is unfinished until we leave this world for the world to come.. but that is not the issue. The issue is that an AD70 focal point for the removal of separation is fundamentally different than what is taught by the entire history of Christianity — which focuses on the cross event of Jesus. If full preterists are comfortable with that difference, then fine. However, it is unbecoming to deny that there is an obvious and fundamental difference.
In my opinion, Christians should never be comfortable with taking the focus off of the cross. To apply the simple point above, I believe that much of the “extreme” doctrine found throughout full preterist circles is a direct result of taking the focal point off of the cross of Jesus Christ.
At the very least, more effort should be put into bringing the overmuch focus on AD70 into some sort of balance. Clearly, full preterism is hugely out of balance on the AD30 / AD70 matter — and this is more than enough of a warning to effectively dissuade any Spirit-led, Jesus-clinging Christian from investigating any closer.
Are not these all clear-headed observations? If so, then it is high time to stop the charges of “bitterness” and “personal problems” and “hatred” which are constantly thrown at the many ex full preterists who make an appeal for remedy using such observations.
I am on Paltalk all the time if anyone wishes to have a charitable conversation about these or other matters.
blessings!
Well, folks,
The “A.D. 70″ matter is easily resolved when we realize that the “soon” coming of Christ was conditional on the NATIONAL REPENTANCE of Israel (Matt. 23: 39; Acts 3: 19-21). Christ will not return until the nation repents. It was because of Israel’s refusal hearken to the wedding invitation that Jerusalem was destroyed in A.D. 70 (Matt. 22: 1-10). Therefore, this was not a “coming” of Christ– whether in type, or in actuality. The parousia belongs to the last 7 years of the age, which were postponed in A.D. 63 after the Acts 28 conference in Rome.
The very fact that there are no Scriptural references to the “famines, earthquakes, and pestilences” that would mark the onset of tribulation tends to prove that progression that progression toward the ’sunteleia’ had halted after Israel formally rejected the kingdom in A.D. 63. When we cross the Dispensational frontier of Acts 28, we are on entirely different ground.
Brian
Larry,
Great job. I say AMEN.. Preterism, and discernment are growing in leaps, and bounds here, along with an eye to seek what God’s word actually means.
With the age of the computer, and the internet as a helping tool the truth is on fire. Oh sure there are folks who beleive what they beleive because they “cant” have been taught wrong, or there certain church cant be wrong. I suppose some of those will always be around.
There are many of us who are grateful for the work you, and Sam and others are accomplishing. As a matter of fact, we are trying to do the same thing, we just have regular jobs!
Blessing’s
Mike Afton
I hear what you are saying Mike, and remember those halcyon days in my own life (1995 to 1998).
Every time our horizons are broadened, it seems like “the thing” we have been waiting for our whole lives. However, given time and experience (meaning a broader perspective than is available in those glorious early days) our destination turns out to be another stop in the maturation process.
Such was certainly the case for me with full preterism. Given time, the shortcomings of the natural focus became clearer and clearer. The previous station in my theological train ride receded out of focus more and more as the approaching station neared.
I don’t know how long you have been a full pret, so I am not at all assuming you are a noob ; after all, our friend Larry has certainly been around long enough to see past the initial blush of enthusiasm into the true face of the system.
I certainly concur with your analysis that “there are folks who beleive what they beleive because they “cant” have been taught wrong, or there certain church cant be wrong.” I guess my only point is to please keep in mind that this is as true for full preterism as any view.
blessings!